[CDNSXV]

Originally Posted by Witold
You guys can delude yourself into thinking your SMs are faster or you are so much faster, but it simply sounds like you are riding with really slow people, or you're riding through some gravel ridden switchbacks where sportbikes don't do well.

Get out there with some Nesba 'A' or even 'I' folks and you will find that 600SS or pretty much any bike can go as fast as you can - not because SMs are slower, but because it's all about the rider. Plus, on the street, it's also about how many risks you want to take. If you are passing people 'on the inside', then you're the risk taking squid, and I would let you go by and keep my distance from you as well.

Basically, to some extent my point is that the trully fast people usually don't brag about passing anyone because it's meaningless and they don't need any ego boost, especially when you're talking about random people who probably have minimal riding experience.

The point being these clowns with minimal riding experience are so full of themselves because they are riding liter bikes and think they are fast because of it. A monkey can learn to hold the throttle wide open.

Being able to ride a SM fast is definately a learned skill. I have been riding and racing supersports for 22 years and this SM thing is not easy. I have raced against SM's and with a good rider they are serously quick ..... for a dirtbike.

This is me on an SV having just passed a motard so I have some experience with the difference between the two types with people who know what they are doing.

I'm really, really in to the idea of making and riding a motard, however I will never ever give up my street bikes... I love the power, the handling and the over all fun factor,

A month ago I probably would have agreed with you. Now after a few weeks of owning a motard, all I can say is that a motard makes any supersport seem dull. Go spend some time with one and you will quickly discover what everyone is talking about. Fun does not have to equal speed.

 

[yzfkneedragger]

You guys can delude yourself into thinking your SMs are faster or you are so much faster, but it simply sounds like you are riding with really slow people, or you're riding through some gravel ridden switchbacks where sportbikes don't do well.

Get out there with some Nesba 'A' or even 'I' folks and you will find that 600SS or pretty much any bike can go as fast as you can -

NESBA sucks.



lol

 

[Dgm08]

A month ago I probably would have agreed with you. Now after a few weeks of owning a motard, all I can say is that a motard makes any supersport seem dull. Go spend some time with one and you will quickly discover what everyone is talking about. Fun does not have to equal speed.

I have to agree. I have been riding for 13 years, roadracing for 1.5 years and have owned everything from RD350's and H2's to 900SS and 748. I stopped riding for 2 years when I got married in 2002 and started a company. I then got frustrated and went to a dealership and purchased a new 999. After putting a 100 miles on the bike I realized that I had changed and didn't want to lane split at 110mph any more, so the bike sat for another 2 years with only 700 miles on the clock when i sold it. My wife, told me that my disposition changed after i stopped riding and forced me to get another bike. After looking long and hard I picked up a new 07 KTM 690 SM last sat. and I can honestly say that i haven't had this much fun on a bike since i was 16. 500 miles in 3 days and I don't think I will ever go back to sport bikes again. Thank you KTM! :bowdown:

 

[svmango]

I have to agree. I have been riding for 13 years, roadracing for 1.5 years and have owned everything from RD350's and H2's to 900SS and 748. I stopped riding for 2 years when I got married in 2002 and started a company. I then got frustrated and went to a dealership and purchased a new 999. After putting a 100 miles on the bike I realized that I had changed and didn't want to lane split at 110mph any more

I picked up a new 07 KTM 690 SM last sat. and I can honestly say that i haven't had this much fun on a bike since i was 16. 500 miles in 3 days and I don't think I will ever go back to sport bikes again. Thank you KTM! :bowdown:

Motards, the mature option.

 

[lckytylr]

I didn't stop riding with those guys because they were slower than me, I didn't go back to ride with them because I want to ride with people that wear gear, not sunglasses, cool holy jeans and backwards hats..........and they spent 20 minutes or so on deciding IF they wanted to go up the canyon that day because some of them wanted to go shopping first at the mall they met at. I now ride with a bunch of older guys that are much much much more experienced and know the pace. they don't wack it open on the straits for no reason, they don't need to look cool.....and they don't need to shop, they need to ride, i need to ride.....it works out well, that's all i'm after. a fun ride, with people that, if the bad ju-ju struck.......wouldn't be leaving sleaves of skin and liqui-brains all over the road. i don't need to see that.

 

[laohu69]

You guys can delude yourself into thinking your SMs are faster or you are so much faster, but it simply sounds like you are riding with really slow people, or you're riding through some gravel ridden switchbacks where sportbikes don't do well.

Get out there with some Nesba 'A' or even 'I' folks and you will find that 600SS or pretty much any bike can go as fast as you can - not because SMs are slower, but because it's all about the rider. Plus, on the street, it's also about how many risks you want to take. If you are passing people 'on the inside', then you're the risk taking squid, and I would let you go by and keep my distance from you as well.

Basically, to some extent my point is that the trully fast people usually don't brag about passing anyone because it's meaningless and they don't need any ego boost, especially when you're talking about random people who probably have minimal riding experience.

100% correct.
The only 2 ways that a motard will win against a sportbike will be if the track / terrain favors it or if the rider is better. If this werten't true then SM bikes would be filling the winners circle at the track. A look at the rules will show that you are allowed unlimited modifications on a single cylinder bike running against stock sportbikes. Even with that advantage they don't dominate. If you switch to a Kart track then the SM bike will dominate.
A better rider will win regardless of his equipment. In the early 1980's I rode a GL500 Silverwing and my buddy rode an early '70's single cam CB500. We outran virtually everything on the streets around SF. By the OP's logic that would mean that Touring bikes were faster than sportbikes.
I've been roadracing for a few decades and I happen to race SM as well (I even managed to win a championship on the 560 last season) and there are damn few streets that I know of where my 560 would outrun my 600. And my 560 will chew up and spit out y'all's street SM bikes. As witold said though, street speed is all about how many risks you're willing to take.
The 2 types of bikes are different tools to accomplish certain things within the parameters of their function. Each will dominate when conditions are favorable for them.
I'm reminded of a saying from my years of fighting (even longer than I've been racing)- anyone who tells you his style of fighting is the ultimate is either a fool, a liar, or both. :hmmm:

Edit: As someone else said though, my SM bike is WAYYYYY more fun to ride.

 

[PureEvil]

There is a very easy way to end the debate of better rider vs. bike. Video it...

Example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0nrMQ3QwyPo :thumbup:

 

[jake]

I really wish people would quit posting my video, I only did that b/c I was cracked on meth

 

[LilMoney]

tweek tweek!!!!!

 

[lckytylr]

I have never been to Deals gap before, i'd love to, but from the looks of it, i would probably rather have my R6 (not that it's street legal anymore) than my motard. those are really nice smooth corners and are nicely spaced. The road that i get the most enjoyment on my motard is.......choppy, the corners are 180 to 180 with no break, it's like a 17 mile cart track. when my r6 was street legal, i used that, it was fun, but i was wishing for some smoother transitions that gave me a split second more between knee-down corners and maybe turns that didn't have 3 different radius'. i took my motard up there and the very first time i did, it was a night and day difference, more confidence, more fun. that road suits motards better than sport bikes. the "Lowman loop" ride suits sporties better for 3/4 fo the trip, but motards better for the really fun stuff. either way, anything on two wheels is fun, but as far as super-tight changing radius corners go....my personal opinion is that motards fare better. i'll also tell you that i never dared to back my R6 into a 90 degree turn like i do my motard. it's just more responsive in my opinion and gives me warm fuzzies. out on the track, i have passed guys with my R6 that were on motards and i have had motards pass me. it is all about rider skill on most roads/tracks, i agree. just wanted to clarify that i'm speaking about those very rare "cart-trackish" roads.

 

[BlkLT1Z28]

please sir, do us and the rest of the world a favor. back away from the computer, pull your panties down and untie that knot, then sit back down and realize how much of a whiner that post makes you look like.

He actually makes sense. In the pic on the first page you can clearly see the huge chicken strips on the tires. I keep up with my buddies when there riding there 625's and Im on my R6 while at the track. Granted some tracks favor sport bikes and some favor motards but either way im with him on the fact that I wont push to hard while on the street.

 

[M Dubya]

NESBA sucks.



lol

:lol::rofl: +++ :bike:

Don't get me started.

 

[M Dubya]

He actually makes sense. In the pic on the first page you can clearly see the huge chicken strips on the tires. I keep up with my buddies when there riding there 625's and Im on my R6 while at the track. Granted some tracks favor sport bikes and some favor motards but either way im with him on the fact that I wont push to hard while on the street.

Twisty roads and tracks are 2 different places. A 400# sportbike cannot by the rules of physics corner as fast as a 300# (or less) SM bike.

SM bike are slow. That is what makes them so much fun. Beating up on my 35 hp DRZ with your 160 hp 1K? You should be so proud. :headshake

I agree, though, passing on the street with out an invite from the leading rider is not a good idea. Go to the track if you want to set people up and pass them.

 

[B_palmer22]

Seeing as I started this thread I feel like I need to put us back on track. I am not a cocky bastard, I just happen to enjoy teaching others about the joys of owning an sm, if it happens to be on an extremely twisty road so be it. if I happen to out ride someone I'm not going to be a dick to them and tell them how much better i am, thats what forums are for, i can vent a little excitement here and save my self from looking like a dick to real people. if i come on here to talk a little smack so what? you guys dont have to ride with me, you dont have to talk to me, hell you dont even know my name. so if i want to gloat a little and you dont like it, go read another thread, i dont really need a lecture about how big my ego is. so moving on, lets get back to some story's. have you guys made a believer out of anyone lately?

 

[snomadd]

He actually makes sense. In the pic on the first page you can clearly see the huge chicken strips on the tires. I keep up with my buddies when there riding there 625's and Im on my R6 while at the track. Granted some tracks favor sport bikes and some favor motards but either way im with him on the fact that I wont push to hard while on the street.

I do have to say my friend does have huge chicken strips on his tires but he only had that bike for a week when I got there, as you can tell by the temp. tag on the license plate, but he has riddin sportbikes for a while and is a good rider. We were on his turf and I was on a road I had never been on before. I still love to give him a hard time about it!!

 

[Nanotech9]

the fun in all this is taking a 200lb 50hp bike (or less!) and riding it so that someone on a 400lb 150hp bike cannot keep up... AFTER they talk smack about how SLOW your bike is, and about how THEY are going to be waiting on YOU.

You take your little 50hp, keep your mouth shut and say... i'll follow you.... then three turns later, when they're poiking around you say "see ya later boys" and take off... grinning from ear to ear about how your 50hp is putting to shame the cocky kids on the literbikes who were denigrating your ride, and looking down at you and your lowly 50hp.


When me and Puck and another buddy (FlyR6) went to Arkansas last month, we had a ton of fun. Fly was on his GXSR600 and I was on my YZ426 and Puck on his '06 KTM450 SMR... We usually take 30 riders out... and break up into an 8-10 bike FAST group, and a 20rider slow group... We do this to save lives.

the "FAST GROUP" isn't all that fast, but we're confident that we can ride at a higher pace, have fun, and not kill ourselves in the process... Usually i tak my '04 ZX10 out, but i took the supermoto this time.

In our group of "fast" people (mostly folks who ride the track on a regular basis) we have NO competitions, NO EGO fights, and we are comfortable switching leaders ever hour or so to give the current leader a rest. We dont haul ass on the straights, and maintain THE PACE.

This all being said, FlyR6 is a fast bastard on the track... I'm decent (but slower than him) and PUCK has nearly reached the level of Track GOD (He turns laps 7 secs faster than me, and about 1 or 2 secs off the pace of Danny Eslick and Cory West (i think these are guys competing in AMA now)....

Myself and PUCK led 100% of the fast group on our ride through the twisties. There were times when teh sportbikes could have powered around us, but in the corners, only our buddy FlyR6 really tried to keep up (and he did so well), but there were a few spots for sure that we put some distance on him (remember, hes faster than i am on a sportbike). Mostly because of the tighter terrain.

All things being equal, he could have been long gone had he cracked it open on the few straights there were, but that aside, we were a pretty good match in the twisties.

Again, all being friends, there no EGO, no RACE, no COMPETITION, nothing... If i feel unsure of leading, i will naturally fall back and let someone else lead... if i think his pace is a bit slow, i'll make my way up next to him, and he'll fall back and i'll lead.



However, if some punk-ass kid starts trash talking my "dirtbike" and acting like hes gonna have to WAIT on me... THEN, the fun starts, and i'm probably going to rub it in his face when i undoubtedly fly by him.


Remember how you said fast guys dont brag? well, thats how we know we can pass the braggers... cause if they were fast, they wouldn't be bragging.... but we HAVe to tell the fun stories about shutting up the punks.

If we were out there and diced it up with another fast rider, and managed a pass on him, then its all part of the ride... nothing to brag about, just an opportunity taken and thats it.

Beating up on punk trashtalking 150hp bike owning kids.... Yeah, i'll brag and joke about that all day long.


One of the quickest street riders in our club just retired and sold his '04 R1 and now owns two Yamaha supermotos... Hes the guy that would disappear, and when you got there he was already working on his second cigarette... Never said a word, and just had a little smirk on his face, but was ALWAYS humble.

I'm proud to say i started keeping him in sight the last few years, and now that hes switched to supermotos (which i've been riding a little longer than him) we're on a little more equal footing (mostly cause hes OLD! lol). Helluva guy, and never one to put anyone down for TRYING. Never liked punk kids on literbikes much though

 

[KaTooM 115]

Yeah, its the rider. Thing is, most supermoto guys are old road racers or bad ass mx racers. Most "street" sport bike guys are new and totally lost on there over powered bike. When I road raced I never rode on the street, in fact, once I started racing I quit riding sport bikes on the street period. YEAH, I spank lots of sporties on my Husky, and my DL , its not hard. But im not a normal "street" rider.

I worked for the OG riding/racing school and one time I had a student say.. " how are you going to teach me anything on a stock zx6 with worn out tires"? He was on a gsxr 750 prod racer. For one lap my boss said show him what you can do and what he cant. After the 1 lap sprint race he loaded up his bike and quit the school day. I was just trying to help him. :headshake

 

[CDNSXV]

I worked for the OG riding/racing school and one time I had a student say.. " how are you going to teach me anything on a stock zx6 with worn out tires"? He was on a gsxr 750 prod racer. For one lap my boss said show him what you can do and what he cant. After the 1 lap sprint race he loaded up his bike and quit the school day. I was just trying to help him.

That is a shame his girly little ego couldn't handle it. I had exactly the opposite experience a few years ago.

I was instructing at the local race school on my SV650 racebike. There were a couple of hotshoe street guys on R1's who wanted to go faster than the other students. They clearly had some skills so I volunteered to take them out for a few sessions. We got going at a fairly decent pace (for street riders) when one of them ended up going off track. We decided to slow things down and focus a bit more on technique. On the last lap I decided to show them the difference between roadracing and street riding. Them on their 160 hp litre bikes got seriously spanked by a 73 hp SV.

Afterwards the one guy came up and thanked me. He thought he was getting pretty fast by the end of the day and had gotten a little bit cocky about it. When I left him for dead on a bike with half the HP he realized just how much he had to learn.

He decided right then to come back and race and in fact turned out to be one hell of a quick track guy. He learned speed faster than I have ever seen anyone learn.

I hate it when people so seriously delude themselves that they can't handle getting beat. Unless you are Valentino Rossi, someone, somewhere is faster than you.

 

[CDNSXV]

Motards, the mature option.

The irony being it is the older, more experienced guys riding the motards like a bunch of 16 year old crazed lunatics.

 

[2ridgebacks]

You guys can delude yourself into thinking your SMs are faster or you are so much faster, but it simply sounds like you are riding with really slow people, or you're riding through some gravel ridden switchbacks where sportbikes don't do well.

Get out there with some Nesba 'A' or even 'I' folks and you will find that 600SS or pretty much any bike can go as fast as you can - not because SMs are slower, but because it's all about the rider. Plus, on the street, it's also about how many risks you want to take. If you are passing people 'on the inside', then you're the risk taking squid, and I would let you go by and keep my distance from you as well.

Basically, to some extent my point is that the trully fast people usually don't brag about passing anyone because it's meaningless and they don't need any ego boost, especially when you're talking about random people who probably have minimal riding experience.

good post i totally agree with you sm riders talk a load of bs and yes youre right fast riders dont need too talk they just do it:thumbup: