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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So I just installed an Adige slipper clutch in my 06 SMR450 and button it all up, bleed the clutch (new ZipTy slave cylinder and 7602 slave piston) and the bike isn't working quite right. I installed the clutch per the video and paper instructions and triple checked everything.

I have the -1 (smallest for least engine braking) shims on the clutch. When I go from neutral (with the clutch lever pulled) to first gear the bike will move forward if I remove pressure on the ground from my feet. I can stop the bike from going forward in first (with the clutch in) if I put my feet down hard or use the brake.

Then, when I start riding the slipper does what it's supposed to do. ie: no wheel hop when downshifting, etc. The bike will wheelie out of first but not second. I used to be able to easily wheelie in second with just a twist of the throttle. However, the MOST concerning thing is that getting into neutral from first or second is impossible with the engine on. I can move the shifter by hand when the bike is off but the trans will not go to neutral with engine on. While riding, shifting is super difficult.

I've tried the other shims and the effect was worse. WTF is going on here? It's like the clutch just doesn't want to disengage fully. Yes, the clutch is 100% air free bled with new mineral oil using the syringe technique from slave->master.

Note: I had the Midwest Mountain Engineering clutch lever on and adjusted the crap out of it but couldn't find a combination of correct clutch pull to fully disengage the clutch, so I put the stock lever back on the bike and it works better but I'm getting this issue with the stock lever currently. Before the slipper clutch the MME lever worked fine.

So, what do you think is wrong and how should I fix it? :headscrat
 

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So I just installed an Adige slipper clutch in my 06 SMR450 and button it all up, bleed the clutch (new ZipTy slave cylinder and 7602 slave piston) and the bike isn't working quite right. I installed the clutch per the video and paper instructions and triple checked everything.

I have the -1 (smallest for least engine braking) shims on the clutch. When I go from neutral (with the clutch lever pulled) to first gear the bike will move forward if I remove pressure on the ground from my feet. I can stop the bike from going forward in first (with the clutch in) if I put my feet down hard or use the brake.

Then, when I start riding the slipper does what it's supposed to do. ie: no wheel hop when downshifting, etc. The bike will wheelie out of first but not second. I used to be able to easily wheelie in second with just a twist of the throttle. However, the MOST concerning thing is that getting into neutral from first or second is impossible with the engine on. I can move the shifter by hand when the bike is off but the trans will not go to neutral with engine on. While riding, shifting is super difficult.

I've tried the other shims and the effect was worse. WTF is going on here? It's like the clutch just doesn't want to disengage fully. Yes, the clutch is 100% air free bled with new mineral oil using the syringe technique from slave->master.

Note: I had the Midwest Mountain Engineering clutch lever on and adjusted the crap out of it but couldn't find a combination of correct clutch pull to fully disengage the clutch, so I put the stock lever back on the bike and it works better but I'm getting this issue with the stock lever currently. Before the slipper clutch the MME lever worked fine.

So, what do you think is wrong and how should I fix it? :headscrat
Sounds like the clutch is partially engaged most the time. One of the parts you installed (probably the slipper) changed the range of motion for the piston, push rod, etc. So the first thing you can try is to adjust the clutch lever. The little red knob


BACK IN A FEW TO FINISH THIS MESSAGE :D GOTTA LEAVE THE PC.. :lol:
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Sounds like the clutch is partially engaged most the time. One of the parts you installed (probably the slipper) changed the range of motion for the piston, push rod, etc. So the first thing you can try is to adjust the clutch lever. The little red knob


BACK IN A FEW TO FINISH THIS MESSAGE :D GOTTA LEAVE THE PC.. :lol:

I think you're right about the clutch being partially engaged. And I think you're right about the range of motion for the piston. The 7602 piston is slightly thicker than stock, ie: because of that perhaps the push rod is not able to come back into the slave cylinder as much as before, hence the clutch being partially engaged.

We're talking about millimeters of engagement here - enough to make it "not right".

So I put the red screw on the stock clutch lever all the way out. Took a ride. Much better, much better. Going through the gear stack is easier now, but still can't get it into neutral with the engine on. The bike almost doesn't move at all when in-gear with the clutch lever pulled in. So that's an improvement. However, if I can't get into neutral that means it's still not disengaging fully and that means I will wear out the clutch faster... so gotta fix it.

I think I'm going to swap the stock slave piston back into the slave cylinder. That means re-bleeding the clutch and I just don't have the patience or shop rags to clean that mess of an operation up right now. Maybe I'll do it this coming week. :hmmm:

Anyone else use the 7602 piston and have any issues like this?
 

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Hey I didn't even have to finish my sentence :lol: You were correct about messing with the red knob. but I wouldn't change out the piston or slave just yet. keep playing with the knob. remember before the engine warms up, the oil between the plates is thicker so it might feel like the clutch is still grabbing a bit. one thing to think about is, if you adjust the red knob out as far as you can (engine warmed up) then you might need to try and make the push rod extend further. maybe a thin washer between the release pin and the bearing. might help, might be too much, but it should help you figure out which way to go.

Oh and I have the 7602 piston in mine with a surfer slipper. I had to do a bit of adjustment due to the slipper. My buddy put a 7602 piston in his TC and didn't have to change anything. He didn't change the clutch out and that is the key factor. Once you change clutches (auto, slipper, etc), there's a good chance you'll have to mess with push rod lengths.
 

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I have the stock slave still in mine and have no issues. When I first installed mine I had to adjust the clutch lever from the stock setting like you are having to do. I will also note, that mine does work better with the stock lever vs the MME lever. I think all the MME lever needs is a longer push rod like JR suggested.
Shifting into neutral is a bit of a bugger with this clutch also. I switched to a better oil and it seemed to help with the notchy shifting. Ride it for a little bit, it will break in. I am currently running the 1mm shim or the middle size shim in the kit. It works very well and I am happy with it.

Gutzy
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Did you find a solution shotgun?
For the most part. I ended up using two of the medium shims on the pushrod to space it out a bit. Neutral is still hard to get into but shifting is great and wheelies are back to normal. I might order some thinner shims to find the perfect combination but overall it's good right now. :hmmm:
 

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For the most part. I ended up using two of the medium shims on the pushrod to space it out a bit. Neutral is still hard to get into but shifting is great and wheelies are back to normal. I might order some thinner shims to find the perfect combination but overall it's good right now. :hmmm:
Good to hear. Remember that adjusting the clutch lever to make the clutch function properly isn't necessarily the best permanent solution. You want the lever to be in the right position for your fingers. So make sure the play of the lever feels good in relation to the spread/grip of your fingers. Then adjust the push rod/release pin accordingly by shortening the push rod (or in your case) lengthening by adding washes to he release pin or even a little weld-tack on the end of the push rod.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Good to hear. Remember that adjusting the clutch lever to make the clutch function properly isn't necessarily the best permanent solution. You want the lever to be in the right position for your fingers. So make sure the play of the lever feels good in relation to the spread/grip of your fingers. Then adjust the push rod/release pin accordingly by shortening the push rod (or in your case) lengthening by adding washes to he release pin or even a little weld-tack on the end of the push rod.
For sure - right now it only works with the lever out at max. I prefer the lever to be in the middle of the adjustment range but I have yet to find a combination of spacers to get that to work. I'll ride it and see if it breaks in a more.
 

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Well I was talking to my buddy today. He said he was reading up on this (after I told him about your predicament) and he was saying that the little red knob doesnt adjust how much the clutch moves, just where the range of movement is. So if the range of movement is an 1" and you adjust the lever all the way out, its still the same range of movement and doesnt move the piston any more, its just so that someone with longer fingers would feel comfortable. And the inverse of that would be lever all the way in for short fingers.
Im scratching my head because when I adjusted the red knob on mine, it really seemed to adjust the clutch play.. :headscrat Gonna look into it more so I know if Im wrong or not :lol: I dont wanna keep tellin you something if I'm totally off!
 

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For sure - right now it only works with the lever out at max. I prefer the lever to be in the middle of the adjustment range but I have yet to find a combination of spacers to get that to work. I'll ride it and see if it breaks in a more.
I've got an Adige slipper on my bike too.

The -1 shims on my bike resulted in clutch slip in 6th w/ 16-42 (road course) gearing. So I'm currently not running any shims, and have no slip issues, the clutch works great.

I've got the same slight clutch drag, making it difficult to find neutral at a stop. I just remember to click it into neutral while still rolling. I think the drag may be caused by the helix angle that Adige uses on the mating hub parts, that's my guess anyways.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Well I was talking to my buddy today. He said he was reading up on this (after I told him about your predicament) and he was saying that the little red knob doesnt adjust how much the clutch moves, just where the range of movement is. So if the range of movement is an 1" and you adjust the lever all the way out, its still the same range of movement and doesnt move the piston any more, its just so that someone with longer fingers would feel comfortable. And the inverse of that would be lever all the way in for short fingers.
Im scratching my head because when I adjusted the red knob on mine, it really seemed to adjust the clutch play.. :headscrat Gonna look into it more so I know if Im wrong or not :lol: I dont wanna keep tellin you something if I'm totally off!

That could be the case with the stock clutch but when I adjust the lever inward it definitely changes how the clutch engages. I'm sure that playing around with the spacers will eventually get me to the ideal place.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Hope ya get it sorted! I'm gonna mess with my clutch lever lol
You wouldn't happen to have the original clutch basket that you would like to sell? My original one is missing in the garage but I have the plates and springs and everything else. I think I might like to put the original back in until I get the correct spacers figured out, as I've got a long ride planed for the last weekend in July and don't want to burn out my slipper if it's not adjusted 100% right.

Yes? sell! sell! :clap:
 

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You wouldn't happen to have the original clutch basket that you would like to sell? My original one is missing in the garage but I have the plates and springs and everything else. I think I might like to put the original back in until I get the correct spacers figured out, as I've got a long ride planed for the last weekend in July and don't want to burn out my slipper if it's not adjusted 100% right.

Yes? sell! sell! :clap:
Clutch basket, Whats wrong with the basket? Do you mean the clutch assembly that you replaced with your slipper?
Your current situation shouldn't do anything to hurt the slipper. If anything, your plates would get a little burnt if your problem was not engaged enough. But since you're on the other end of the spectrum, you should be fine.
Just keep switching out ships on the release pin until you get the right combo.
 

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Oh and I dont have a spare basket at the moment. I have a spare clutch in case my slipper were ever to have problems, but that isnt for sale..



One thing you could try, it would take a bit of wrenching and time, but should yeild you a result. you'll need measuring calipers. What you'll be doing is measuring the distance from the back of both clutches to the inside edge of the pressure plate bearing. (where the release pin rests against.) Then you can compare the measurement from the OEM clutch and the slipper clutch to find out how thick your spacer needs to be on the realse pin!

For this you need the slipper clutch and the OEM clutch out on the bench. Assemble them as if they were in the bike. Lay them face down so you see the back side. Most slipper clutches (STM and Surlfex for sure, not sure about Adige) use a second spacer between the basket and clutch IN ADDITION to the OEM spacer. So you need to put that second spacer (if there is one) on the back side of the slipper. Dont worry about the OEM spacer as it goes in regardless of which clutch is in.

Using the long end of the calipers, measure the depth from the back side of the OEM clutch down to the edge of the inside race on the throwout bearing. Record this measurement. Then do the same with the slipper clutch. Only this time, there will be the spacer sitting on there so measure from that surface down to the bearing.

If the depth of the slipper clutch is greater than the OEM clutch (which yours sounds like it is) then you'll need a spacer that is as thick as the difference between the two. If the depth of the slipper was more shallow than the OEM clutch, you would need to take that amount of material off of the end of the clutch push rod.


Make sense?? I have been writing long and confusing responses lately.. :lol: I will take some pictures in a bit to give you an example.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Oh and I dont have a spare basket at the moment. I have a spare clutch in case my slipper were ever to have problems, but that isnt for sale..



One thing you could try, it would take a bit of wrenching and time, but should yeild you a result. you'll need measuring calipers. What you'll be doing is measuring the distance from the back of both clutches to the inside edge of the pressure plate bearing. (where the release pin rests against.) Then you can compare the measurement from the OEM clutch and the slipper clutch to find out how thick your spacer needs to be on the realse pin!

For this you need the slipper clutch and the OEM clutch out on the bench. Assemble them as if they were in the bike. Lay them face down so you see the back side. Most slipper clutches (STM and Surlfex for sure, not sure about Adige) use a second spacer between the basket and clutch IN ADDITION to the OEM spacer. So you need to put that second spacer (if there is one) on the back side of the slipper. Dont worry about the OEM spacer as it goes in regardless of which clutch is in.

Using the long end of the calipers, measure the depth from the back side of the OEM clutch down to the edge of the inside race on the throwout bearing. Record this measurement. Then do the same with the slipper clutch. Only this time, there will be the spacer sitting on there so measure from that surface down to the bearing.

If the depth of the slipper clutch is greater than the OEM clutch (which yours sounds like it is) then you'll need a spacer that is as thick as the difference between the two. If the depth of the slipper was more shallow than the OEM clutch, you would need to take that amount of material off of the end of the clutch push rod.


Make sense?? I have been writing long and confusing responses lately.. :lol: I will take some pictures in a bit to give you an example.

Great idea - I'll buy some larger calipers and do that. Makes perfect sense.
 
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